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Joe Roark

60th Anniversary of Paul Anderson's Back Lift

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Joe Roark

Perhaps I misunderstood- I thought the statement referred to Paul and Doug being at the same venue at the same time.

I am aware of all the claims listed. But again, as was Paul's proclivity in the bench press even the 627 was not his max.

I have seen refs to Paul benching 550 for 5 reps, but I also have communication from Hepburn saying he saw Paul bench 500 for a single and it was a royal struggle.

He wrote the following to a friend of mine (and member here):

 "The 627 pound bench press is a little slight of what I've actually done. I could only pinpoint this particular lift when asked about it." what is slightly more- what does that MEAN, and further what does it mean to be able to pinpoint it only when asked about it- wasn't that what this communication was all about?

As I mentioned elsewhere, a real, tight and tidy bio needs to be written about Anderson, not by someone in awe of him but by someone who knows the timeline. Frankly, I feel I know enough to do it but have no interest because in my view the truth is less than the hype.

Someone recently pointed out to me that once something is denied (the backlift was the topic) then where does the investigation end? Do we keep unraveling lift after lift among the unofficial lifts? I took this to mean that because Paul has passed we should let it go. And while I, believe it or not, have no personal agenda against Paul, I do have a personal agenda to have the record unadorned with the bunting of false lifts.

To say that Paul was the strongest man of his day may be accurate, but to say he was the strongest man who has ever lived, simply shows the writer stopped following lifting after Paul's era (or put blinders on while following it). It is an embarrassing statement to proclaim to any group aware of what has happened since his day. This is why, at least for the moment, I will not pursue some of these other lifts claimed, and it may be more beneficial if others study and have their eyes opened.

There are still people who believe that he was never defeated in a lifting contest!

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Liam Tweed

Thanks for those thoughts Joe 

i guess the problem here is the fact that people have continued to represent that these lifts are factual. 

This is made worse by the fact that he turned professional early in his career certainly before he has reached his full potential. 

And then there is the showmanship element which makes the waters even more murky . Athletes whoes reputations stand purely on their competitive achievements do not have that luxury what they achieved is a matter of public record there can be no debate. 

Sometimes people just want to "believe" in something the fantasy is so much more comforting than the reality. 

The story that I always think of is Terry Todds MD series with Paul on strength which started with a story of him visiting PA at the boys home and watching Paul hitting a golf ball between 2 barbell racks of 400 lbs and 800 lbs ( I may be remembering the weights incorrectly) . Paul pressing and squatting for reps at the respective barbells as he walked between them hitting the ball back and forth.

certainly sounds like a PA training idea 

if that's the correct weights than that is an amazing feat 

Liam

 

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Bob Fett

Some of these lifts may have been partial lifts.

Anderson was noted for his use of partials.

A person ignorant of lifting (not Terry Todd of course) might see Anderson doing a partial press-out with 700 lbs and misstate it.

The error is passed on and on.

As to the "circus lifts", we can only conclude these were just inaccurate and done for promotional purposes. Anderson could not be honest about them without hurting his integrity.  One lie covers another. 

We will never know the truth but certainly Anderson was not capable of performing some of the fantastical lifts he is attributed.

Not even the huge athletes of today could do these lifts.  Are we to believe Anderson was stronger than a Brian Shaw or Eddie Hall?

 

Edited by Bob Fett

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Liam Tweed
Just now, Bob Fett said:

 

Not even the huge athletes of today could do these lifts.  Are we to believe Anderson was stronger than a Brian Shaw or Eddie Hall?

 

this is exactly what I have been thinking

that is utterly ridiculous

we currently have in the field of strongman genetic specimens that go far beyond anything ever seen in the world of strength

to assume someone 5' 9" even at enormous bodyweight was even in their league is pure fantasy

Liam

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Dale Credico
On 6/14/2017 at 4:03 AM, Joe Roark said:

Somehow the Silver Doller Squat in Reno at the Mapes Hotel went from 600 to 900 to 1100 to 1200 lbs it seems even though the weights stayed unchanged.

I'm sure the joke about INFLATION has been made already.

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Dale Credico
On 6/14/2017 at 4:32 AM, Liam Tweed said:

. . . and shoudn't diminish the respect we have for the man

That point is important to consider. There's no disrespect in wanting to know the facts behind and truth about the back lift in question.
All the properly documented lifts remain the same and stand alone regardless of any other claims.
There's a strange 'all or nothing' view that's problematic sometimes with we humans.

But that listing of claimed lifts! Whoa, there's something wrong with some of those numbers
and the fact that next to no one called him on them.

Edited by Dale Credico

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Joe Roark

Sometimes inferior writing misleads us. One site offers that by 1957 Paul's backlift of 6270 was put into Guinness, but we know that was not unto 1970, or perhaps 1969 which edition of the GBWR I have not seen.

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Bob Fett

You will have little success trying to convince a "believer" of the facts.

It's like discussing religion or politics.

Logic don't enter into it.

:(

 

Edited by Bob Fett
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Joe Roark

My goal is to present the timeline as accurately as possible then the reader can pick a side to believe. You are correct: fans or fanatics will not be swayed from their foxholes.

regarding the 720 lb jerk from the rack, is there any current strongman who could ever jerk that amount? Nope, but a furnished foxhole is a comfy place.

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Liam Tweed
13 hours ago, Joe Roark said:

My goal is to present the timeline as accurately as possible then the reader can pick a side to believe. You are correct: fans or fanatics will not be swayed from their foxholes.

regarding the 720 lb jerk from the rack, is there any current strongman who could ever jerk that amount? Nope, but a furnished foxhole is a comfy place.

Joe who started that 720lb jerk sillyness?

surely not someone who has any understanding of strength and the iron game?

i think that the analogy of these beliefs  with religion is an accurate one , through emotive and not logical associations anything is "possible" even if it flies in the face of logic , science and historic evidence not to mention the probability and common sense tests. In these situations its best to leave people to their own beliefs and walk away (shaking your head in wonder)

Liam 

Edited by Liam Tweed

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Joe Roark

Liam wrote: Joe who started that 720lb jerk sillyness?

Herb Glossbrenner told me of this years ago, so I, having never heard of this claim, asked for details. He said he would check and get back to me. Shortly he replied he had checked on the lift and the poundage was 720. No more details.

Now, I fancy I have some of the most complete files on Anderson of anyone I am aware of, and I hasten to add, that Paul never claimed this in any of the materials I have ever read. So I do not know where Herb got the info and knew it was pointless to pursue it, figuring it came from the official GRM (Gossip Rumor Mill).

You may recall that Herb wrote a praise of Anderson some years ago which included a simply embarrassing number of incorrect statements- even some which Herb noticed and had corrected in the following issue. Even then, several errors remained, so I am unsure where he was getting the info, but it probably again that fount of all funk, the GRM.

This error cannot be laid at the feet of Anderson though, who cannot be faulted when others misrepresent him.

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Bob Wildes
1 hour ago, Joe Roark said:

Liam wrote: Joe who started that 720lb jerk sillyness?

Herb Glossbrenner told me of this years ago, so I, having never heard of this claim, asked for details. He said he would check and get back to me. Shortly he replied he had checked on the lift and the poundage was 720. No more details.

Now, I fancy I have some of the most complete files on Anderson of anyone I am aware of, and I hasten to add, that Paul never claimed this in any of the materials I have ever read. So I do not know where Herb got the info and knew it was pointless to pursue it, figuring it came from the official GRM (Gossip Rumor Mill).

You may recall that Herb wrote a praise of Anderson in Iron Man some years ago which included a simply embarrassing number of incorrect statements- even some which Herb noticed and had corrected in the following issue of Iron Man. Even then, several errors remained, so I am unsure where he was getting the info, but it probably again that fount of all funk, the GRM.

This error cannot be laid at the feet of Anderson though, who cannot be faulted when others misrepresent him.

I have a very extensive collection of Paul Anderson materials offered when he was alive through the PAYH. I have never seen a claim from remotely approaching

a 720 pound jerk. 

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Joe Roark

If there is anyone you would want to share my article with, simply send the link- I posted the piece in an open area of the forum for this purpose.

This may help to dissolve some of the moss/fiction still growing around the supposed feat.

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Joe Roark

A member shared these photos of the current Anderson house, where the back lift was reported to have happened. Photos from this week (June 24, 2017)

IMG_0964.JPG

IMG_0963.JPG

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Liam Tweed
1 hour ago, Joe Roark said:

A member shared these photos of the current Anderson house, where the back lift was reported to have happened. Photos from this week (June 24, 2017)

IMG_0964.JPG

 

Is that a memorial to Paul Joe?

I hope the state of that road is not typical of the US suburbs?

if so its now wonder that Americans rave about our roads and highways in SA , always seemed strange to me

Liam

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Jim Duggan
19 minutes ago, Liam Tweed said:

Is that a memorial to Paul Joe?

I hope the state of that road is not typical of the US suburbs?

if so its now wonder that Americans rave about our roads and highways in SA , always seemed strange to me

Liam

As for the condition of the road, that's nothing.  You should see the roads in Brooklyn, NY. Horrendous!

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Jarett Hulse

Good piece Joe. When you first posted it I thought it was the same piece you wrote and posted on cyberpump years ago.  I didn't realize it was new

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Joe Roark
43 minutes ago, Jarett Hulse said:

Good piece Joe. When you first posted it I thought it was the same piece you wrote and posted on cyberpump years ago.  I didn't realize it was new

 

While there is, of course, some overlap, this time I tried to put matters in chronological order to show that, if it were not for Liederman's original story revealing the weight of the safe at 2,300 lbs the story would be much harder to illustrate. And to show that that weight, in fact, never was increased in reality, just in story, or so it certainly seems.

There is more repetition that I prefer using, but I have learned that those who still believe in the back lift lore need to be reminded.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Bob Fett
4 hours ago, Liam Tweed said:

Is that a memorial to Paul Joe?

I hope the state of that road is not typical of the US suburbs?

if so its now wonder that Americans rave about our roads and highways in SA , always seemed strange to me

Liam

I don't see any potholes so that road is above average.

Infrastructure is in very bad shape here in the good 'ol USA.

No money for infrastructure but billions/trillions for the military industrial complex.

12 aircraft carriers ain't cheap y'know!

How many does SA have by the way? ;)

Check out this baby.  One of these would probably re-pave all the roads in North America.

A cool $10.44 billion (before cost over-runs and options of course).

The USA is going to launch one every three years! 

Actually, it has a road on top of it with no potholes.  Neat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_R._Ford-class_aircraft_carrier

gerald-ford-aircraft-carrier-696x538.jpg

Edited by Bob Fett

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Joe Roark

Yes, it is a memorial to Paul. When I was there a couple of decades ago the road was in good shape.

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Joe Roark

When I wrote this piece, I made an effort to close diversions (by not including them). But the few criticisms I have seen about the piece  that have been sourced elsewhere seem to focus on things other than what my piece focuses on, to wit: did Paul, using the equipment claimed, lift 6,270 lbs. I used Cyr only because Paul used Cyr as his target to surpass.

I am aware of Gregg Ernst's record- and that it took him 18 years of slow progression to master it, so yes, this does also summon the question as to why Paul could manage more in what amounts to about one year.

But to stay on topic, we are discussing Paul and his claim in this piece.

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Liam Tweed
7 hours ago, Bob Fett said:

I don't see any potholes so that road is above average.

Infrastructure is in very bad shape here in the good 'ol USA.

No money for infrastructure but billions/trillions for the military industrial complex.

12 aircraft carriers ain't cheap y'know!

How many does SA have by the way? ;)

Check out this baby.  One of these would probably re-pave all the roads in North America.

A cool $10.44 billion (before cost over-runs and options of course).

The USA is going to launch one every three years! 

Actually, it has a road on top of it with no potholes.  Neat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_R._Ford-class_aircraft_carrier

gerald-ford-aircraft-carrier-696x538.jpg

Our military is pathetic

used to be no 5 in the world

"soldiers " go on strike when they think they are being badly treated

if we had a war nobody would pitch , they would all be on "sick report"

our navy is a navy in name only , couple of patrol boats maybe

I think we have a few subs , not sure what for

the US is right to maintain a strong military, I think its the money the US spends on helping the rest of he world that is the problem not the military spending

most of the money goes into the pockets of dictators anyway decades of helping other countries has resulted in nothing but creating more dependency ,

Malawi s GDP is almost 100% foreign aid ...

Liam

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Joe Roark

Let's get away from politics. My original hunch was to remove the photo of the ship with the comments, but I did not.

Anyway, back to the topic please.

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Bob Fett

Right, sorry Joe.

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peter yates

Hi Joe,just catching up after my trip and read this excellent piece. The Chinese have a saying,"No investigation,no right to speak."Unfortunately there are few who actually go to the trouble of investigation to unearth as much as possible the facts,especially when it comes to strength feats. Of course the same people are only too ready to shout and condemn when someone actually takes the trouble to seek out he truth and make it known.Thank you Joe for being one of the "investigators,"and having the courage of your convictions. This is in no way a disrespect to Anderson but respectful to all the other strongmen past and present who can back up their claims with evidence.

Peter.

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